The Unofficial Sugarloaf Chat

Someone's trash is someone else's gold... " The existing Swift Current lift, built in 1996 alongside Gondola One, will be sent to Salt Lake for refurbishment and re-installation at another Boyne resort in 2021."

Rossignolsoul7 wrote:Someone's trash is someone else's gold... " The existing Swift Current lift, built in 1996 alongside Gondola One, will be sent to Salt Lake for refurbishment and re-installation at another Boyne resort in 2021."

The nice thing about the Swift Current lift is that it's Big Sky's longest at 8,555 feet. That means that it would be well-suited to just about any purpose at Sugarloaf including a Bucksaw replacement (or Snubber for that matter). We'll take it!

goldenboy80 wrote:

Rossignolsoul7 wrote: The nice thing about the Swift Current lift is that it's Big Sky's longest at 8,555 feet. That means that it would be well-suited to just about any purpose at Sugarloaf including a Bucksaw replacement (or Snubber for that matter). We'll take it!

My source just told me it is going to moved to Sunday River to replace the White Cap Quad (not to be confused with White Heat Quad). Nothing moves to SL. I don't feel that it's a good move. Maybe someone from SR can tell us if it's a crowded lift? This is also implying that Barker gets a full upgrade to 6-D.

Rossignolsoul7 wrote:

goldenboy80 wrote:

Rossignolsoul7 wrote: The nice thing about the Swift Current lift is that it's Big Sky's longest at 8,555 feet. That means that it would be well-suited to just about any purpose at Sugarloaf including a Bucksaw replacement (or Snubber for that matter). We'll take it!

My source just told me it is going to moved to Sunday River to replace the White Cap Quad (not to be confused with White Heat Quad). Nothing moves to SL. I don't feel that it's a good move. Maybe someone from SR can tell us if it's a crowded lift? This is also implying that Barker gets a full upgrade to 6-D.

Funny
Had not heard they would replace that lift. It’s a work horse lift and very wind resistant But not a critical “ski” lift
The next lift after #1 that needs replacing if the Aurora lift IMO

I saw surveyors on Barker last week
Fingers crossed

Rossignolsoul7 wrote:Nothing moves to SL.

Are those old Big Sky cabins still sitting in the woods?

I thought there was some real exciting news coming out soon(!) for SL. At least that was said at homecoming meeting I believe.

Glade Monkey wrote:

Rossignolsoul7 wrote:Nothing moves to SL.

Are those old Big Sky cabins still sitting in the woods?

There are some on Sugarloaf property. People smoke weed in them I believe

Ezra wrote:I thought there was some real exciting news coming out soon(!) for SL. At least that was said at homecoming meeting I believe.

lift announcement coming next year

Rossignolsoul7 wrote:

goldenboy80 wrote:

Rossignolsoul7 wrote: The nice thing about the Swift Current lift is that it's Big Sky's longest at 8,555 feet. That means that it would be well-suited to just about any purpose at Sugarloaf including a Bucksaw replacement (or Snubber for that matter). We'll take it!

My source just told me it is going to moved to Sunday River to replace the White Cap Quad (not to be confused with White Heat Quad). Nothing moves to SL. I don't feel that it's a good move. Maybe someone from SR can tell us if it's a crowded lift? This is also implying that Barker gets a full upgrade to 6-D.

Not terribly crowded but White Cap is the only base without High Speed service out of it. Always have thought that was part of the reason guest interest in using that access point has withered (the lodge is not in the greatest shape although Shipyard just did a full Reno of their space this year). There have also been rumors of MASR being moved over to White Cap in the near future. A detachable lift out of that base for their participants would probably be warranted and welcomed if so. It wasn't a priority by local management in the past to replace it, in fact, I had heard they didn't want a detach there. But things change and an overhauled, used HSQ might be a differentiator in changing plans there. Time will tell. Brighton seems set out west, but Snowqualmie and Cypress might need one too. I suppose Loon isn't out of the question either, if they are still going to do the South Peak learner pod and actual base area. It was suppose tonhave two FGQ's with Carpet loads, but they might go with this instead for the longer of the two. Lots of choices for Boyne.

Glade Monkey wrote: lift announcement coming next year

It's only a few days away...

Maybe they bought two.

According to Steve Kirscher, Boyne CEO, in the Storm Skiing Podcast interview, Sugarloaf’s “game changing” new lift has been designed and the project put out to bid to the lift manufacturers. Therefore, I don’t think it’s a rehab.

Im thinking the 'game changing' new lift will be a chondola to Bullies.

SpillwayEast wrote:Im thinking the 'game changing' new lift will be a chondola to Bullies.

Just curious why you think a chondola over a normal gondola? Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t combination lift stations different to allow for both carriers to enter and thus it is more expensive? I feel like if Boyne were to do it, they would go full on gondola to allow for dinner at Bullwinkles and a more developed area at the top of the lift. I’m more curious to see whether or not it would follow the survey line or old bucksaw and whether or not Boyne would make it D Line. Sunday River did a chondola for better integration with the lodge at the top and to keep chairs to serve the beginner skiers that lap that terrain. I feel like bucksaw is a low to mid intermediate area and at that point, you could take the SQ up and then cut over making a chondola unnecessary. Just my two cents though.

I think that for any lift to be a signature lift, it has to serve signature terrain. A lift to bullwinkles, no matter where it begins/what line it takes, is pretty unremarkable without either a second stage of the lift that continues to the summit, or a separate, second lift going from bullies to the summit. I don't think I'll start lapping Windrow all day just because a new lift goes up. Currently, the signature terrain at the loaf is served by three FG quads, two old, one new(ish). You all know what these lifts are.

I was at SR the other day and I have to say the chondola has grown on me, I don't think it would be a terrible option for base-bullies. Combines the option of having gondolas for nighttime activities without sacrificing uphill capacity significantly. I don't think the additional loading/unloading stations represent significant additional cost either.

Whistler-Skier wrote:

SpillwayEast wrote:Im thinking the 'game changing' new lift will be a chondola to Bullies.

Just curious why you think a chondola over a normal gondola? Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t combination lift stations different to allow for both carriers to enter and thus it is more expensive? I feel like if Boyne were to do it, they would go full on gondola to allow for dinner at Bullwinkles and a more developed area at the top of the lift. I’m more curious to see whether or not it would follow the survey line or old bucksaw and whether or not Boyne would make it D Line. Sunday River did a chondola for better integration with the lodge at the top and to keep chairs to serve the beginner skiers that lap that terrain. I feel like bucksaw is a low to mid intermediate area and at that point, you could take the SQ up and then cut over making a chondola unnecessary. Just my two cents though.

Peak dinners at SR are packed and #7 serves it fine
I did have to take a cat ride down when it iced up one night

Looks like heated bubble high speed chairs are “signature lifts”. This would work great for nighttime dining and summer access to Bullwinkles for events. The eight passenger one at Big Sky is a good example of a lift used this way.

essslsclsact wrote:Looks like heated bubble high speed chairs are “signature lifts”. This would work great for nighttime dining and summer access to Bullwinkles for events. The eight passenger one at Big Sky is a good example of a lift used this way.

Right. They use the Ramcharger heated 8 to whisk people to dinner at Everett’s.

Skimaine wrote:

essslsclsact wrote:Looks like heated bubble high speed chairs are “signature lifts”. This would work great for nighttime dining and summer access to Bullwinkles for events. The eight passenger one at Big Sky is a good example of a lift used this way.

Right. They use the Ramcharger heated 8 to whisk people to dinner at Everett’s.

Yes, they did use chairs the first season on Ramcharger for this. However, this season they are suppose to add a few 8 or 10 pax cabins to the line to make it a Chondola. No idea if they will limit foot traffic after that to just Gondola cabins. SR limits foot traffic in winter to Cabins up and down on Chondi. In the summer, foot traffic can ride chairs up but MUST take cabins down. This is because they build an unload platform at the top of the chair in the summer but the base terminal is set up for Cabins loading/unloading on DH side of base station and would be hazardous to unload chairs on that side.

Whistler-Skier wrote:

SpillwayEast wrote:Im thinking the 'game changing' new lift will be a chondola to Bullies.

Just curious why you think a chondola over a normal gondola? Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t combination lift stations different to allow for both carriers to enter and thus it is more expensive? I feel like if Boyne were to do it, they would go full on gondola to allow for dinner at Bullwinkles and a more developed area at the top of the lift. I’m more curious to see whether or not it would follow the survey line or old bucksaw and whether or not Boyne would make it D Line. Sunday River did a chondola for better integration with the lodge at the top and to keep chairs to serve the beginner skiers that lap that terrain. I feel like bucksaw is a low to mid intermediate area and at that point, you could take the SQ up and then cut over making a chondola unnecessary. Just my two cents though.

The primary overhead structure is the same for chairs only, cabins only, or a combination of both (chondola). The difference in the terminals is on the floor, the cabin load/unload side needs some type of guide rails to stabilize the cabins laterally on that side of the flooring. The chair load/unload side also needs to have the snow height maintained very closely so the cabins have clearance over the snow surface when they pass those sides.

$7.5 million offered for Hermitage Club assets
Posted Tuesday, January 14, 2020 7:36 pm
By Chris Mays, Reformer Staff
This story was updated at 7 p.m. Wednesday

BURLINGTON — Two offers totaling $7.5 million outlined in bankruptcy court documents could kick off the auction process for former Hermitage Club properties.

Rainmaker Mountain LLC is offering $4 million for the Haystack Mountain ski area that had been run as private ski resort before Hermitage Club companies faced financial struggles and went bankrupt; the Hermitage Inn and Snow Goose Inn in West Dover; the Horizon Inn, Haystack Golf Course and undeveloped parcels of land in Wilmington. A separate purchase of the Barnstormer chairlift, a six-person with bubble chairs, for $3.5 million is being proposed by Boyne USA Inc., which owns ski resorts in North America.

Berkshire Bank filed a foreclosure complaint involving Hermitage properties in 2018. The bank and the group of club members who paid for the chairlift agreed to the sale, according to court filings submitted by Raymond J. Obuchowski, the Chapter 7 bankruptcy trustee assigned to the case.

If the court agrees to move ahead with Obuchowski's proposal, an auction will soon be advertised. He is looking for a bid deadline of Feb. 20 with a sale on Feb. 25.

Obuchowski described the sale of the ski area as valuable to creditors and the estate.

"The Trustee and the secured lenders believe that the total consideration to be paid by Stalking Horse [Rainmaker Mountain] is fair and reasonable and, moreover, the Auction will establish the highest and best offer for the Sale Property," his court filing states.

Alan Tantleff, the court-appointed receiver tasked with preserving the Hermitage properties through the foreclosure and bankruptcy, told the Reformer he could not disclose anything that is not public when asked for information about Rainmaker Mountain.

Robert Coffin, a former Hermitage Club member who had been hopeful about an effort of members to purchase the assets, said he had not heard of the company.

"[T]hat's clearly not a good thing for everyone, as it reduces (probably completely) the club getting going again, which clearly would be the best thing for prior members and local businesses and people in general," he told the Reformer in an email.

Reach staff writer Chris Mays at cmays@reformer.com, at @CMaysBR on Twitter and 802-254-2311, ext. 273.

Good detective work:

Superquad: Vertical 1,783 Length 6,655 Towers: 23
Barnstormer: Vertical 1,181 Length 5,450 Towers: 22

Barker's replacement

Don’t forget, Boyne will soon be awash in cash. Remember those new Burnt Mountain house lots that were announced last fall? The announcement set this forum alight with giddiness over visions of the new Sugarloaf lifts that money would buy.

skiloaf wrote:Good detective work:

Superquad: Vertical 1,783 Length 6,655 Towers: 23
Barnstormer: Vertical 1,181 Length 5,450 Towers: 22

Spooky internet shit. My son-in-law and I were talking about the Hermitage Club. He skied there a few years ago. I am sure Alexa was listening. She whispered to Zuckerberg and poof an article on the Hermitage Club shows up in my Facebook feed.

Nice work on the lift stats.

A few questions that need to be answered before I would jump to conclusions on a moving a lift.

1) Who is Rainmaker Mountain?
2) What is the cost of moving a lift? E.g. is $3.5m plus that cost less than the cost of a new lift and by how much to make the desperation worth while.
3) What is the value of Haystack without the lift vs with it?

Once that is answered, you can think about wither Boyne is moving the lift, working with Rain Maker or already has a relationship with Rain Maker

I would expect that Rain Maker and Boyne have some kind of relationship and in the end Boyne will be running (if not owning) a new mountain in NE with the lift remaining there.

Loon got a new 10 year plan along with a flashy video to show off their new 8-pack which is approved & planned to begin installation this spring.

https://www.loonflightpath.com/

vcskier wrote:A few questions that need to be answered before I would jump to conclusions on a moving a lift.

1) Who is Rainmaker Mountain?
2) What is the cost of moving a lift? E.g. is $3.5m plus that cost less than the cost of a new lift and by how much to make the desperation worth while.
3) What is the value of Haystack without the lift vs with it?

Once that is answered, you can think about wither Boyne is moving the lift, working with Rain Maker or already has a relationship with Rain Maker

I would expect that Rain Maker and Boyne have some kind of relationship and in the end Boyne will be running (if not owning) a new mountain in NE with the lift remaining there.

Here's a partial answer to #1 https://www.reformer.com/stories/potential-hermitage-buyer-identified,594866

Glade Monkey wrote:Loon got a new 10 year plan along with a flashy video to show off their new 8-pack which is approved & planned to begin installation this spring.

https://www.loonflightpath.com/

Boyne's Eastern Jewel is now known and does not start with an S.